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Jamie


Posts: 987
Joined: Jan 2002
Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 19.18hrs on Fri 4 Jul 14
The Strathspey and Badenoch Herald announces that Save the Ciste campaigners are to meet with Natural Retreats (the new operator on Cairn Gorm) next week regarding the Coire na Ciste Chairlifts:

Strathspey and Badenoch Herald: Cairngorm chairlift campaign group welcomes talks



NR are to be commended for agreeing to meet and discuss the issues with the campaign team, and we look forward to entering a positive dialogue with them.

We will explain why there is a campaign and we will explain to them our case for Coire na Ciste. On behalf of our ~3000 petition signees and the economy of Strathspey as a whole, we will then ask Natural Retreats to commit to Coire na Ciste *now*.

We will tell Natural Retreats that our aim is to see the reinstatement of the two chairlifts in Coire na Ciste. We cannot expect this to happen immediately, and so for next season we will ask them to commit to operating the West Wall Poma whenever possible; last winter the lift was operated for just ~16 days, despite the runs being skiable for over 5 months.

To ensure a maximum possible length of the ski season in Coire na Ciste without aid of the chairlifts, we will ask them to commit to a short-term plan of reinstating the boardwalk leading out of the Ciste Gully which was removed this summer. We will ask them to conduct essential snowfencing repairs with some urgency where vital links have fallen down and presently act to shorten the ski season (i.e. the fencelines out to the East Wall Gullies, and the fencelines which border the West Wall Poma uptrack).

Above all, at the meeting on 8th July 2014 we will be asking Natural Retreats to commit to an open and transparent examination of the economic viability of bringing the chairlifts back into life. We believe very truly that this study will point towards the reinstatement of the two chairlifts in Coire na Ciste as being the only sensible economic way forward.

As ever, I encourage people to sign the e-petition:
www.savetheciste.com :: e-petition to reinstate the Coire na Ciste chairlifts on Cairn Gorm
some frustrated skier


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16th Feb 2021
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 23.35hrs on Fri 4 Jul 14
A very positive step. Well done NR for getting key groups involved.
Doug_Bryce


Posts: 1373
Joined: Jan 2003
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 09.10hrs on Sat 5 Jul 14
Good work (& good luck.....)
Nice to see something productive grinning smiley



[www.haggistrap.co.uk]
JC


Posts: 624
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27th Feb 2024
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Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 11.33hrs on Sat 5 Jul 14
Good to hear. Please report back with how the meeting goes. This season was my first ever where I didn't ski at Cairngorm, over recent seasons my visits there have declined due primarily to Coire na Ciste not being adequately lift-served. It is for me the main reason for going to ski there, it's the jewel in their crown and if NR want to maintain CG as a proper ski centre, which must include the more challenging runs of the Ciste, the chairs have to be reinstated.
Hipennine


Posts: 1061
Joined: Dec 2005
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 11.57hrs on Sat 5 Jul 14
JC Wrote:
Good to hear. Please report back with how the meeting goes. This season was my first ever where I didn't ski at Cairngorm, over recent seasons my visits there have declined due primarily to Coire na Ciste not being adequately lift-served. It is for me the main reason for going to ski there, it's the jewel in their crown and if NR want to maintain CG as a proper ski centre, which must include the more challenging runs of the Ciste, the chairs have to be reinstated.


Seconded, and good luck at the meeting. Well done guys.
Andy28


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9th Mar 2021
What's this?
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 16.54hrs on Sat 5 Jul 14
Hipennine Wrote:


Seconded, and good luck at the meeting. Well done guys.


thirded. after 2 disastrous visits the year before with the place running above capacity and managing 1 run an hour I doubt i will be back to Cairngorm, even the halfpipe wasnt enough to tempt me up this year.
sspeirs


Posts: 370
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22nd Apr 2021
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 20.12hrs on Tue 8 Jul 14
At the risk of being completely slammed ... :-) ....

I personally find the tone of the "demands" above quite aggressive ("commit to" etc etc). I don't think it helps your case. I don't think it will help NR make their internal case. If I tried this in my job with my management, I'd be quickly out of the door :-)

I suggest you may get on a lot better if you help the new operator understand the business case for re-instating these lifts. How would this help them achieve their goals? Solve some of the problems they have recognised? A clearly written document, with reasonable estimates on numbers, would help. Sure you may argue this is not your/our job but if you want to help the new operator understand more about the true opportunity, would you prefer a third party consultant who has very limited exposure to the Scottish snowsports market to write that report for you?

For example, how many extra skier days could this help them achieve? How many current season ticket holders would use these lifts (alleviating queueing elsewhere). How many more ticket + seasons tickets sales would you estimate? How would these lifts help in other objectives etc? How could it reduce people's "start time" on a busy day (e,g, last time I was at Cairngorm on a busy day I arrived at 8:30pm and got to the top by 11am, after queuing for tickets, how could these additional lifts help). And lift waiting time on a busy day - 40 mins is not unusual in my limited experience at CG, how could the new lifts help? How could the new lifts extend the season? by how many days? How many skiers per day? (can it be significant? - bearing in mind there is a large drop off in skiers/boarders at e.g. Glencoe late on in the season) Could a new chair be more mountain bike friendly for summer sports, mountain biking in the Ciste etc?

etc
etc

I think you have some good points above that are quick wins e.g. reinstating the boardwalk while small could win them some brownie points and let NR show progress - worth prioritising your "suggestions" [not demands :-)] into list of quick wins (management teams usually always like these), medium term goals and longer term.
You could offer to run a survey via the Winterhighland user base to get the new management some of the feedback they need to make their internal case

OK as I say I stand back to get slammed :-)

Stephen
Olderalan


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7th Apr 2019
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Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 21.24hrs on Tue 8 Jul 14
Stephen: Thank you for posting up your views to which you are quite entitled. I think that you are going to be surprised to find out what has been agreed following this afternoons vey positive meeting with NR. You should also know that the savetheciste campaign isn't a 'closed shop.' Anyone who can commit their time to helping and can make a positive contribution would be very welcome.
We would just ask for a little patience [a day or two] before more info is made public as we'd like to give NR time to consider the main point summary that was sent to them following our meeting.
Please note...nobody should be expecting the chairlifts to be returned to use 'tomorrow' but we will be continuing to work towards that end.

Kind regards

Olderalan
kevinboyle82


Posts: 117
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6th Jun 2016
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 13.30hrs on Wed 9 Jul 14
Bit of luck NR add a bit of common sense to proceedings. They are losing money from not having lift-assisted access to that terrain.
Olderalan


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7th Apr 2019
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Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 21.32hrs on Fri 11 Jul 14
We are pleased to report that the savetheciste campaign was invited to sit down with senior members of management from NR and discuss the possibilities for future operations [winter & summer] in Coire na Ciste.

Discussions took place on Tuesday 8 July with Ewan Kearney [chief of operations] and Adam Gough [head of the technical services team & the man who will manage on-going and future investment into the snow-sports infrastructure]

We explained to them why there is a savetheciste campaign and also detailed the significant support behind it. Discussions also centred on the operational strategy that marginalises Coire na Ciste and its impact, now evidenced by a decline in market share.

We were very well received and it was good to engage with a management team who had no preconceptions and were very keen to listen to what we had to say. It's very much a can-do attitude now and the management are interested in finding solutions and engaging with stakeholder groups.

It was agreed, on the day, that the campaign would produce a detailed plan for the re-development of Coire na Ciste. This plan will then be presented to NR following which we'll jointly investigate the economic/financial case.

It will be a tough assignment but it is one that we will very willingly undertake. We'd hope to have this plan completed by mid Autumn.
Our view is that this is a very major step in the right direction and a considerable divergence from what has gone before.

Nobody is making any promises and it is very early days but greatly encouraging.

Kind regards

Olderalan



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 21.36hrs Sun 13 Jul 14 by Olderalan.
MPW1


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1st Nov 2018
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 03.50hrs on Sat 12 Jul 14
That's an outcome which must surely have exceeded your expectations! Excellent. Perhaps other forum members could volunteer to lend support in what will surely be quite a task in preparing a proposal. I'm thinking along the lines of those with accountancy backgrounds, for example, to help prepare forecasts. What resources might be useful to you?

Michael
PeterS


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Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 09.27hrs on Sat 12 Jul 14
Good start. I wonder if the board walk be a possible volunteer project ?
Olderalan


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7th Apr 2019
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Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 20.17hrs on Sat 12 Jul 14
MPW1 Wrote:
That's an outcome which must surely have exceeded your expectations! Excellent. Perhaps other forum members could volunteer to lend support in what will surely be quite a task in preparing a proposal. I'm thinking along the lines of those with accountancy backgrounds, for example, to help prepare forecasts. What resources might be useful to you?

Michael


Thanks for that. Once we've had the chance to sit down and discuss the way forward then we'll certainly be keen to get help from anyone with skills that may be helpful. It'll be the end of the month before we can say more [and we need to talk to NR a bit more first]

Kind regards

Olderalan
sspeirs


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22nd Apr 2021
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 20.14hrs on Sun 13 Jul 14
good progress indeed, well done all
Jamie


Posts: 987
Joined: Jan 2002
Re: Ciste Chairlift campaign to meet with Natural Retreats
Date Posted: 09.24hrs on Sun 27 Jul 14
The Strathspey and Badenoch Herald reports last week on the outcome of a recent meeting between Save the Ciste Campaign members, and senior members of management from Natural Retreats (the new operators at Cairn Gorm):


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