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Altaholic


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 17.48hrs on Thu 30 Nov 17
TGO have an article on their website - [www.tgomagazine.co.uk] .

chrisski


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 20.33hrs on Thu 30 Nov 17
so any update on this leaglly and what have th police said?

some frustrated skier


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 21.40hrs on Thu 30 Nov 17
Quick question.

In line with the agreement of NR running the area do they pay a premiums to HIE for the privilege?

what...snow


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 22.09hrs on Thu 30 Nov 17
The tgo article is pretty good. I understand the 'their loss', ignore them anger about this but think some diplomatic language and a link to the facts would be helpful. Three useful views at midstation level have been removed. On the cairngorm mountain website their 'replacement' view is massively inferior, as noted in the article. As well as the time stamps, their is no longer a view of the balcony to gauge new snow depth. The quality of the image is also poorer.

Previously, I would only consider Cairngorm at the extremes of the season due to previous experiences (massive queues, lifts in the wrong places, poor overall experience, the usual complaints) but now I won't consider skiing or visiting until there are substantial changes. It's such a pity that the skiing experience is so dismal as Aviemore has fantastic apres ski and with decent lift infrastructure Cairngorm would offer an appealing mix of runs.

Think I would send all links to Cairngorm website to a page saying 'Sorry we are no longer linking to Cairngorm because the lift operator wants all images and lift status updates to be available from its website only. They have stopped supplying information to the national service, Ski-Scotland and removed webcams without consent' or something similar.

Jamesybob


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 09.07hrs on Fri 1 Dec 17
This has appeared on Public Contract Scotland:

Title: Review of Cairngorm Ski Area Uplift Infrastructure
Published by: Highlands and Islands Enterprise
Publication Date: 30/11/2017
Deadline Date: 10/01/2018
Deadline Time: 12:00
Notice Type: 02 Contract Notice
Has Documents: Yes
Abstract: HIE requires a suitably qualified and experienced supplier to undertake a comprehensive, independent review of the uplift facilities at Cairngorm Mountain ski resort to determine the best way forward for potential reinvestment in the infrastructure including the long-term feasibility of redevelopment of Coire na Ciste. The review will significantly contribute to preparation of a 5-10 year long-term strategy for the ski area.
The contract is anticipated to be awarded for 8 months with an optional 2 months extension in case unforeseen circumstances delay the delivery of the services.
The total value of these services over the maximum duration of 10 months is estimated to be around GBP 75,000 and GBP 80,000 excluding VAT. This budget includes all Travel & Subsistence payable under this contract and any extension period, if required.

[www.publiccontractsscotland.gov.uk]





Doug_Bryce


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 09.21hrs on Fri 1 Dec 17
Jamesybob Wrote:
This has appeared on Public Contract Scotland:

Title: Review of Cairngorm Ski Area Uplift Infrastructure
Published by: Highlands and Islands Enterprise
Publication Date: 30/11/2017
Deadline Date: 10/01/2018
Deadline Time: 12:00
Notice Type: 02 Contract Notice
Has Documents: Yes
Abstract: HIE requires a suitably qualified and experienced supplier to undertake a comprehensive, independent review of the uplift facilities at Cairngorm Mountain ski resort to determine the best way forward for potential reinvestment in the infrastructure including the long-term feasibility of redevelopment of Coire na Ciste. The review will significantly contribute to preparation of a 5-10 year long-term strategy for the ski area.
The contract is anticipated to be awarded for 8 months with an optional 2 months extension in case unforeseen circumstances delay the delivery of the services.
The total value of these services over the maximum duration of 10 months is estimated to be around GBP 75,000 and GBP 80,000 excluding VAT. This budget includes all Travel & Subsistence payable under this contract and any extension period, if required.


Jeezuz - Paying 80K just to be told that systematically destroying your own lift system over last 10 years was a bad idea. This money on top of the 300K to remove the Ciste lifts would have gone a long way to resolving the issues. Indeed surely this task is one than Natural Retreats (the lift operator) should be capable of doing themselves given they are already taking a large management fee.

Let me provide the summary for free...

1) Removal of Ciste Chairs means one of the most snow sure runs on hill (ciste gully) no longer properly served.
2) Only mid mountain lifts suitable for advanced skiers are M1 poma / Coire Cas and Ciste Poma. This leads to long queues at weekends.
3) The overflow car park in Coire Na Ciste no longer has lift access leading to frustration on busy weekends with shuttle buses.

I suspect this contract will be awarded to a certain ex-employee previously involved in the 'core lift' policy. Though in a fair world the 80K contract would be awarded to the save the ciste group who have already provided the answers winking smiley

paulo


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 11.30hrs on Fri 1 Dec 17
Jamesybob Wrote:

The contract is anticipated to be awarded for 8 months with an optional 2 months extension in case unforeseen circumstances delay the delivery of the services.
The total value of these services over the maximum duration of 10 months is estimated to be around GBP 75,000 and GBP 80,000 excluding VAT. This budget includes all Travel & Subsistence payable under this contract and any extension period, if required.



Is it normal to state the expected value of these public contracts? Certainly isn't in my line of work. Also outlining a lengthy schedule and then allowing 2 months overrun from the outset! Does rather sound like they already have an individual in mind that they want to get onboard...



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 11.31hrs Fri 1 Dec 17 by paulo.

Doug_Bryce


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 11.51hrs on Fri 1 Dec 17
^ Call me a cynic. It is a bit like the USA exclusively awarding contracts to rebuild Iraq to American firms. Flatten the place to ground them make sure you benefit from the lucrative rebuild winking smiley

The real frustration is the other 4 ski areas survive on less public money but deliver more for snow sports.

Jamesybob


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 13.11hrs on Fri 1 Dec 17
Paulo,

It's reasonably common to state budgets and programmes for these contracts, I think the idea is that people bidding then have a better idea of what is expected so the bids line up better with what is wanted and it should be easier to see which will give the best result / quality.

You may well be right though about someone already in mind. I like the idea of it being Save the Ciste group or perhaps Aviemore and Glenmore Community Trust could do the study.

ropetow


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 13.58hrs on Fri 1 Dec 17
[www.gov.uk]

gives some insight as to why it takes public bodies so long to do stuff.

public bodies cant just award contracts to whoever they like as it would be open to legal challenge.



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 14.00hrs Fri 1 Dec 17 by ropetow.

Rhys Jaggar


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 16.16hrs on Fri 1 Dec 17
The reality of consultancy is this:
1) You advertise, invite tenderers to bid, hold a beauty parade, appoint a contractor. This will take 3 months: six weeks to submit, 2 weeks to review submissions, short-list and invite to present, 1 weeks presentations, final selection, 1 weeks sign off schedule of work in formal contract.

In this case, it is expected that work will start in early February 2018.

2) Reality is that when convening interested parties for consultations/focus groups, you schedule 4-8 weeks in advance as these people are likely busy and you want to do a block of meetings together on one trip to Aviemore.

3) Extra time scheduled in is an indication that the project is sensitive, has aroused inflamed emotions and any solutions proposed may have strong detractors. It is saying the project will slip, it is reflecting known backround realities.

4) I have seen the schedule of work and it is fairly chunky. Yes, part of it is straight engineering work solely suitable for a specialist, but a fair size is concerning broader issues of tourism, marketing, market analysis, global benchmarking, business planning, financial analysis and options development. An ideal team for the project would have a ski resort engineer, a business professional who has skied for years and maybe a cost accountant as well.

Based on the budget 100-150 man days are envisaged over a 7-9 month period.

Pretty typical midsized consultancy project.

Rhys Jaggar


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 16.28hrs on Fri 1 Dec 17
Who HIE select will depend on their motives and imperatives.

Option 1: an outsider not involved in the current disagreements
Option 2: a team suited to an already preferred solution.
Option 3: other reasons.

Save the Ciste being hired would suggest relations with the current leaseholders are rocky, as Save The Ciste have not minced their words in public statements. It could also be seen as a way of buying them off from a Community-led buyout.

I must say carrying out this work after cutting down the Ciste lift infrastructure, rather than before, is slightly surprising, and may point to desired directions of the project outcomes as a result. But until someone speaks frankly with HIE, that is just speculation.

some frustrated skier


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 08.52hrs on Sat 2 Dec 17
Suitably qualified and experienced in the field ski lift infrastructure.

Only two big companies Poma & Doppelmayer.

Mr Core Lift Policy is not a suitable person to make any decisions.

tupp


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 09.22hrs on Sat 2 Dec 17
some frustrated skier Wrote:



Mr Core Lift Policy is not a suitable person to make any decisions.






He'll fit in well with the rest of the operation up there then. 80K for printing out an HIE pre-decided outcome will be a nice boost to someones pension pot.

Just keep who ever it is away until the snow goes. Another consultant/saviour/expert up there with their pants permanently on fire won't do the snow resilience any good.



01cookjk


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Webcams
Date Posted: 10.21hrs on Sat 2 Dec 17
tupp Wrote:
some frustrated skier Wrote:



Mr Core Lift Policy is not a suitable person to make any decisions.





He'll fit in well with the rest of the operation up there then. 80K for printing out an HIE pre-decided outcome will be a nice boost to someones pension pot.

Just keep who ever it is away until the snow goes. Another consultant/saviour/expert up there with their pants permanently on fire won't do the snow resilience any good.



Thanks for adding some humour to this pretty depressing feed.

I have some ideas for Cairngorm / Ciste and they can have them for free. Pretty sure CGM / HIE can afford the 23.9 million needed for such a development as below, or they could always take the 1.5million budget option for a single 2nd hand detachable triple or quad simply running from the ciste car-park to the Ciste Bowl.

I think the key here is that any new lift should run a bit closer to the gully so as to remove the need for a boardwalk. The most expensive part of any project like this is gonna to be preserving the ground and thus hiring out a helli-swiss copter or similar to do most of the lifting of goods.

Please note that the mock-up plans attached were produced around 2015 before we knew just how stupid NR, CGM and HIE were going to become.....and of course they are complete fantasy. I don't think they are realistic in the real world!



Attachments: new pisteplan 4.jpg (343kB)  
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