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youngfox


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 08.11hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
Then HIE should sue the contractors or in the public interest walk away and see if NR/CGM dare sue them. The cost of removal is astounding. Are you really saying that in the end they will plough more dosh in. Black Hole

Pardon my resentment, but Cairngorm has sucked the life out of further big meaningful ski development elsewhere for years, and now this. Personally I would rather see another development elsewhere and further investment in the West. Imagine that £27mill spent opening up the East side of the NR back corries into an alpine scale resort.

Dunc


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 08.15hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
I find it hard to see how Charlotte Wright would be 'delighted' with any aspect of this whole sorry mess.

Dunc


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 08.22hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
youngfox Wrote:
Then HIE should sue the contractors or in the public interest walk away and see if NR/CGM dare sue them. The cost of removal is astounding. Are you really saying that in the end they will plough more dosh in. Black Hole

Pardon my resentment, but Cairngorm has sucked the life out of further big meaningful ski development elsewhere for years, and now this. Personally I would rather see another development elsewhere and further investment in the West. Imagine that £27mill spent opening up the East side of the NR back corries into an alpine scale resort.


Totally agree. I'm not as knowledgeble as many on here with reagrds to the deatails of all this. But what I do see is a ski resort that has had millions ploughed in to it, and that has been systematically wrecked despite this. The sums of money invloved are astounding, and could and should have been more equitably distributed, which would have led to fantastic improvements at the other 4 (well run) resorts.

The slowest car crash ever?

malks


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 10.24hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
that press release does not make for good reading, definitely sounds like the funicular will not be running this season.

I have only been to cairngorm a few times, much rather spend my money elsewhere, but I do feel sorry for aviemore and the surrounding areas for the knock on effect this will have.

a couple of casual observations I've had are:

- can they realistically service the top station with only surface access? Deliveries or food/ supplies/ ferrying staff etc..... do they have enough capacity to this on snow mobiles/ cats??

- access, I get they 'could' patch together enough snow at low level to use only surface lifts to access the full mountain. but realistically are beginners really going to be able to make it to the ptarmigan area? if the beginners get up, how the hell are they going to get back down, its not exactly beginner friendly all the way back to the bottom! do they think they can knock together enough snow at low levels to make sufficient beginners areas?

TroutWrestler


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 11.37hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
I emailed Cairngorm last night with exactly those questions, plus others. I am awaiting a reply.

If the reply is as confusing, contradictory and evasive as when I asked about where the data for their website weather forecasts comes from, I don't hold out much hope. Numerous emails got me nowhere.

Doug_Bryce


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 11.39hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
I used to be jealous of Cairngorms level funding. However the funicular black-hole has destroyed the ski area over a 15 year period. In addition it has also deprived the other 4 areas of potential funding and support. Charlotte Wright (CEO of HIE) should be brought before a parliamentary committee and asked to explain the mistakes made. Trying writting them a letter and you just get fobbed off.

Interestingly the Scottish government have been trying to replace / modernise HIE for many years... However opposition parties have staunchly united to prevent it happening. So many questions : not least the cosy relationship HIE have with Natural Retreats. (Not just at Cairngorm but also John O Groats!)

MSPs vote to 'reverse' Highlands and Islands Enterprise plans
[www.bbc.co.uk]

[www.northern-times.co.uk]

Incidentally - without the train then 3 lifts are required to get to the summit without walking. Fiaciall Ridge Poma -> Coire Cas -> M1. You could use Car Park T-bar + M1 (with a short but steep hike). Without train the mountain is unsuitable for small children / learners / tourists. Which of course means their entire business model will need to be re-calibrated for winter.

Will be interesting to see if they actually make effort to run Daylodge Poma and West Wall this season. The capacity will be needed... Without train then they simply wont be able to cope on busy weekends or holiday periods - unless of course numbers self limit. A winter season with snow to mid-station would obviously make it impossible for them to operate at all....

An unholy and very expensive mess.



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 11.40hrs Fri 12 Oct 18 by Doug_Bryce.

paulo


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 12.13hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
Doug_Bryce Wrote:

Incidentally - without the train then 3 lifts are required to get to the summit without walking. Fiaciall Ridge Poma -> Coire Cas -> M1. You could use Car Park T-bar + M1 (with a short but steep hike).


Quite a while since I've been, but thought it's also possible to get to top via Daylodge and WWP ?

flugeryl


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 12.34hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
hire a snowcat bus(es) to take beginners to the top and back down

it will be a tourers paradise on bluebird days

Heli skiing is the way...when its not foggy or windy (Hmmm maybe not)

Snow taxes using snowmobiles £5 each way

walk up and earn your turns...like the 1960s

or

Go to Nevis and moan about the braveheart chair

malks


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 12.52hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
dont really know if it matters or if anyone will care, but I found this link interesting. It is the original tender/ portal for applicants to run 'cairngorm mountain'

[www.publiccontractsscotland.gov.uk]

I think the asbtract is quite interesting in relation to what has/ is happening at cairngorm:

This will include management of all snowsports related commercial activity, management of all year-round tourism operations, maintenance of assets on Cairngorm Mountain, retail/equipment hire, management of the UKís highest altitude restaurant and additional catering and all hard FM related to skier uplift infrastructure and Scotlandís only funicular railway.
In particular, the Authority is looking for an operator to drive the snowsports business, while providing a clear strategy for service diversification to wider non-snowsports activity. This would allow more consistent year round cashflows, as well as year on year profitability, which is currently highly dependent on available skier days.


So HIE wanted someone who was going to maintain all the assets and drive the snowsports business....... because its a business thats highly dependent on the available skier days. It sounds like Natural Retreats hasnt done any of these things.......

awrightski


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 12.55hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
have they finished the new post and rail fencing on WWP uptrack?

TroutWrestler


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 13.22hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
You can take Fiacaill then M1. No need for Cas tow to get to the Ptarmigan.

jabuzzard


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 13.58hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
Assuming they are running can you not use the Daylodge Poma and then the West Wall Poma to get to the top? The removal of the Ciste chairs in 2017 for not much more in 2015 they could have been put back into service, while knowing in 2016 there was developing issues with the funicular needs a public enquiry given the money involved through the damage to the Speyside economy. We have a right to know who knew what when and why the removal of the chairs proceeded with such haste and with lack of consultation given the evolving issues with the funicular. Then the relevant heads need to role.

01cookjk


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 15.17hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
SnowmanDave Wrote:
alan Wrote:
its a total mess...& the blame is all HIE..they screwed up the initial funicular design/contracts & the ensuing stupid legal stuff re the operation which restricted it...& then they think that NR are wonderful & give them the contract to run it...




I agree. HIE is at the top of the chain and they are ultimately responsible. I think its time for high-level government to intervene and start firing people, quickly and without empathy or bribery.

The place needs a fresh start, and that starts with a new organizational line of command, ideally with as few pencil pushers and managing directors as possible and as many workers out on the feild (mountain) as possible. ....Once that is in place, confidence will be re-established, as will trust, season pass sales will increase and hopefully a substantial grant will follow soon after.

I don't know who suggested it, but re-jigging the funicular so it runs from the Sheiling direct to the top station with a chairlift running up to it and a second chairlift up the ciste valley with a mid-load station as well engineered pylons and sheave trains would be the way forward.



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 15.25hrs Fri 12 Oct 18 by 01cookjk.

TroutWrestler


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 17.24hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
01cookjk Wrote:
SnowmanDave Wrote:
alan Wrote:


I don't know who suggested it, but re-jigging the funicular so it runs from the Sheiling direct to the top station with a chairlift running up to it and a second chairlift up the ciste valley with a mid-load station as well engineered pylons and sheave trains would be the way forward.



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 16.25hrs Fri 12 Oct 18 by 01cookjk.


I can't say I agree. A telemix might be OK from Glenmore/Cas carpark, The reality is the demographic of summer time funicular users is not skewed towards those who can use a chairlift, and the uplift needs to be suitable for year round operation for all user groups.

SnowmanDave


Guest
Re: CairnGorm Funicular - Operation stopped as safety precaution
Date Posted: 18.44hrs on Fri 12 Oct 18
With disability access required etc for tourists & disabled skiers the funicular is the best....

Just it was badly designed for the situation....
What is needed is an overhaul & improve the system as much as can be done with what is there, otherwise you won't get the lifetime investment out of it.

..I think we are too early on to call quits on it & even in a repaired state its not too bad..

Vertical expansion joints at every pier...maybe move the mid station to the x-over track also....maybe alter the track heights etc at certain points to sort over drifting etc...better fencing around it...simple solutions to get the most out of it...

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