You are NOT Logged in.
Chat about all aspects of snowsports, backcountry, climbing and mountaineering.
Goto Thread: PreviousNext
Goto: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In
Goto Page:  Previous123
Current Page:3 of 3
alan


Posts: 10750
Joined: Nov 1994
Last Visited: 23:28
2nd Dec 2021
What's this?What's this?What's this?
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 15.00hrs on Sat 1 Dec 07
Water is not an insurmountable problem in Scotland. There is spare capacity in the existing pumps in the Fiacaill pump house to feed water to four fan gans, that could probably be 8 air water guns and operating at fairly marginal temps the flow rate is reduced so more guns can be fired for given capacity.

In the past 9 days the numbers of hours where the Wet Bulb temp has been below a given temp is:

Tw -1°c 77hrs [Marginal snowmaking with high pressure air/water]
Tw -2°c 66hrs [Upper limit for Ratnik Low energy air/water]
Tw -3°c 45hrs [upper limit SMI Highland Fan Guns]
Tw -4°c 29hrs
Tw -5°c 8hrs

Assuming there is water for four such fan guns at medium flow rates and we only have four guns. According to SMI stats put into a spreadsheet for the highland fan gun, for a run the length of the Zig Zags and 10m wide run the four guns could have put down an avg depth of 16inches in the period Tw was at or below -4°c. Another 6inches in the period where Tw was below -3 but above -4°c.



growwild


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 15.19hrs on Sat 1 Dec 07
ropetow Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Does anyone have any experience of the DIY
> snowmakers you can see on the web ? How much water
> does it take to make snow ? I've got an old ex-gas
> board compressor and a 5hp petrol pressure washer
> - but i dont have a snowgun to use with this.
>
> Does anyone have a gun that i could borrow to try
> it out ?
-----------------

I have a couple in bits, there aint much too them really.. Thery are easy to build, its the nozzles that need a bit messing with to get it just right...

U dont need the pressure washer to build T/Y gun, as these are low pressure with the water and air getting mixed inside.. These use the most air, and best for marginal temps and ya can make the nozzles yerself.

If ya plan on using the pressure washer then a high pressure gun is yer answer,these are harder tae build and the air/water mix done outside mostly, these use less air and the temps need to be a bit colder for them to work good and the nozzles will have to be bought for this..

Then ya get fan guns, yip ya can make home-made ones, the nozzles will cost a few quid with the amount usualy needed.. Though these use less air as the big fan in them does a lot of mixing.. But these are no good for marginal temps, unless ya throw more air throw it, but then that defeats the purpouse of them being efficiant..

Edit- I ment tae say, yer best starting with seeing how much air yer compressor blows and how much water flow and at what pressure the pump is, but i think most folk start with the...

And if yer gonna be taking water from the house, put a check valve on it as the last thing ya want is tae blow yer toilet through yer roof!! (and I'd put one on the compressor too just incase)




Edited 1 times. Last edit at 15.32hrs Sat 1 Dec 07 by growwild.

Attachments: Y-Gun.jpg (40kB)   y-gun1.jpg (86kB)   fan-close-front-1.jpg (81kB)  
ropetow


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 17.30hrs on Sun 2 Dec 07
Its a 6 cylinder English Electric diesel engine with the back 3 cylinders modified to pump air into a receiver- i.e. theres no injectors on these cylinders. It would run 3 breakers at once - so i think the answer to how much air it can produce is 'plenty'.

I've got access to a private water supply with a 30m head on a 25mm pipe as well - so i'm not going to run it from the garden tap.

My understanding was that the Y & T guns were pretty much inefficient as you really needed a nucleus to 'seed' the snow production. All the nozzles i've seen on the web are 3 nozzles.

Is it worth making up a Y nozzle or do you have any to lend/sell ?

Thanks


growwild


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 00.12hrs on Mon 3 Dec 07
Plenty is still gonna determine what size of gun ya need, if yer near 185cfm, which i guess(hope) you are then u could make a shit load of snow if ya can get enough water into it..

A lot of the ones on the net with say 3 nozzles use higher pressure water to make them more efficiant as air costs a lot to make, so thety hope to make more snow with less air...

One nozzle usually at the bottom is the "nucleator" and in this goes the air and water which crates a fine mist which in turn will "seed" the water coming from the nozzles above each other. These, the water only nozzles would have a different flow rate, the one just above the nucleater will be on when the temps are at x, then when they drop low enough to allow more water the other nozzle would be turned on..

The nucleation nozzle mentoned above is just a y/t-gun with an internal mix, with extra water added to it for when the temps drop and a high pressure of water is there..

With high air and good water flow then something like this [www.ratnik.com] but notice the pressure indicated on the water, if you have a good flow then [www.ratnik.com] as these will make a better quality of snow and more at a lower temp...

For a nozzle get some pipe caps, thats what i have at the moment(undrilled), youl need a few, and start drilling, depending the water and air how big the hole/s will be and how many etc.. Thats where i'm at, so we're at the same stage, got the stuff, just need tae test so i can see what works(ie hole sizes).You can buy nozzles perfect for the job, but ya still need the info on yer air and how much water u have. Best make yer own, its more fun!

With lots of air, make the y-gun bigger, say with 1 inch or 1.5, and with the compressor ye have and a bigger water pump, say a Fire pump( about 500 aff ebay) then ya could open a run easy, if u had water. I could go and get one of those now, but nowhere to use it, only place i can get that water just now is off a hydrant, and its not cold enough tae open a resort in Clydebank, i have thought about dalmuir golf course as the burn there has good flow and the "wee drap" is steep with the burn at the bottom,lol.

One more thing,lol. have u a cooler on the compressor as lots of air heats up, sometimes too much tae make snow, another thing thats stumped me going big...

Gooood luck



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 00.25hrs Mon 3 Dec 07 by growwild.

cmorrison


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 11.24hrs on Mon 3 Dec 07
Awesome Growwild and Ropetow.

I'll be round at the clydebank snow park jsut as soon as yer done! saves me the trip through the tunnel to Xscape.

How pissed would you be if you turned up at a golf course one morning and one of the holes had been converted into a terrain park over night!

Chris

g


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 19.45hrs on Mon 24 Mar 08
growwild Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ropetow Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Does anyone have any experience of the DIY
> > snowmakers you can see on the web ? How much
> water
> > does it take to make snow ? I've got an old
> ex-gas 2 gallons a second
> > board compressor and a 5hp petrol pressure
> washer
> > - but i dont have a snowgun to use with
> this.
> >
> > Does anyone have a gun that i could borrow to
> try
> > it out ?
> -----------------
>
> I have a couple in bits, there aint much too them
> really.. Thery are easy to build, its the nozzles
> that need a bit messing with to get it just
> right...
>
> U dont need the pressure washer to build T/Y gun,
> as these are low pressure with the water and air
> getting mixed inside.. These use the most air, and
> best for marginal temps and ya can make the
> nozzles yerself.
>
> If ya plan on using the pressure washer then a
> high pressure gun is yer answer,these are harder
> tae build and the air/water mix done outside
> mostly, these use less air and the temps need to
> be a bit colder for them to work good and the
> nozzles will have to be bought for this..
>
> Then ya get fan guns, yip ya can make home-made
> ones, the nozzles will cost a few quid with the
> amount usualy needed.. Though these use less air
> as the big fan in them does a lot of mixing.. But
> these are no good for marginal temps, unless ya
> throw more air throw it, but then that defeats the
> purpouse of them being efficiant..
>
> Edit- I ment tae say, yer best starting with
> seeing how much air yer compressor blows and how
> much water flow and at what pressure the pump is,
> but i think most folk start with the...
>
> And if yer gonna be taking water from the house,
> put a check valve on it as the last thing ya want
> is tae blow yer toilet through yer roof!! (and I'd
> put one on the compressor too just incase)
>
>
>
>
> Edited 1 times. Last edit at 15.32hrs Sat 1 Dec
> 07 by growwild.




igloo4you


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 11.05hrs on Mon 20 Nov 17
Ropetow, Got one at home in Falkirk, used it a lot when my kids were small. It's a compressor, pressure washer and a 10ft or so long pipe with nozzles on it. Had many days when our garden was snow (or ice) filled while rest of the area was green. You are welcome to have a play with it if you want. Only thing that cost any sort of cash was the pipe with the nozzles. andy@andymeldrum.com



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 11.07hrs Mon 20 Nov 17 by igloo4you.

flugeryl


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 13.35hrs on Tue 21 Nov 17
so you cant just get the kracher pressure washer oot the shed and go mad with the high pressure washer adapter in the gun?

freeskiing


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 20.09hrs on Thu 23 Nov 17
Andy, if Ropetow doesn't take you up on the offer then I'll happily test it in Grantown and make you an offer if you're looking to pass it on.

Cheers, Ben.

01cookjk


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 20.58hrs on Mon 18 Dec 17
I tried making snow with some nozzels (not the right type) 160psi air and 135psi water a few days ago. I ended up with a very weird sort of snow-ice mixture on the ground - quite like snow that has partially melted into grainy spring snow, then re-froze into an almost immovable block.

Buying a 2nd hand fan gun & an old PistenBully are both on my bucket list to do before I hit 60 (many years to come!) and really its just about being inquisitive and being a man with boys toys. At the moment I am lucky enough to own a plot of land with a 63amp 3phase power supply on it and a 2'' water line, so, one day!!!!

ropetow


Guest
Re: Make snow at 30C ?
Date Posted: 15.37hrs on Tue 19 Dec 17
igloo4you Wrote:
Ropetow, Got one at home in Falkirk, used it a lot when my kids were small. It's a compressor, pressure washer and a 10ft or so long pipe with nozzles on it. Had many days when our garden was snow (or ice) filled while rest of the area was green. You are welcome to have a play with it if you want. Only thing that cost any sort of cash was the pipe with the nozzles. andy@andymeldrum.com



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 11.07hrs Mon 20 Nov 17 by igloo4you.


Hi - have sent you an email Andy.

Goto Page:  Previous123
Current Page:3 of 3
Your Name: 
Your Email: 
Subject: